Oppo Homeschoolers?

"Ash78, voting early and often" (ash78) 04/25/2016 at 09:44 • Filed to: None

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Any parents (or students) of a homeschool environment out there in Oppoland? My wife and I are about to register our son in a good public school in our area, but we’re also considering a private school ($$$) and homeschool options. My wife and I both did public schools for almost our entire educations (including college) and made it through to the other side, but we’re still trying to figure out if we want our kids on the same path...we’re totally up in the air!

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 09:50

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I was homeschooled all the way into highschool, and at that point cross-pollinated my curriculum with the local community college (“dual enrollment”, as it is called). I can broadly recommend it in a number of respects, but I have to state that either the parents have to be competent at teaching math or you need to find someone who is. Math in a lot of respects is harder for self-guided learning past the early high school level, so either dual-enrolling for that along with the biology/hard lab sciences or getting someone to tutor would be a good idea.

Ash78, voting early and often > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 04/25/2016 at 09:52

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Awesome, thanks. We’re not too worried about the math & science through middle school (or so), but once we hit high school, I think we’d probably pony up for a homeschool group where the toughest subjects are taught by paid professionals (usually retired professors, etc). Those types of groups seem to be gaining traction.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 09:54

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Yep. I was behind the wave on that, but I have siblings that got some instruction that way.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 09:54

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Having gone to college with a surprising number of home schoolers, the biggest hurdles aren’t just the technical teaching of math and science, but getting them socialized. They......they stick out a bit when they finally hit society otherwise. RamblinRover mentioned dual enrollment. I think that’s a good idea. Upshot of homeschooling is you are entitled to tax credits and refunds (basically your school tax is paid back to you)

BJ > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 09:56

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I have cousins on one side of the family that were homeschooled. My aunt was a teacher by profession before deciding to homeschool - she managed six (!) kids with probably a 15-year gap between youngest and oldest. They were always very involved in extracurricular activities such as sports, arts, and church. The kids are smart, well-adjusted, and very sociable.

I have cousins on the other side of the family that were homeschooled. My (ex-)aunt had no idea what she was doing and completely failed the children. When the government threatened to step in, the kids were sent to school. The oldest was in 5th or 6th grade, and they had a very hard time adjusting. For the most part, their education worked out. Excluding a bunch of other inter-family drama, the kids turned out smart, more-or-less well-adjusted, and very sociable.

My point is that it’s hard work and not everyone is capable of doing what it takes. My opinion is that you should start with the public school and, if necessary, augment the experience with sports, tutoring, arts, etc. If ever that doesn’t work for your child, then you can look at the alternatives.

Caleb "If a rally car can do it, so can my Malibu" M. S. > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 09:58

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I was homeschooled 1st-6th, and then private grade school, and now private highschool.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 09:59

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So I was a swim coach a while back and you could always spot the home schooled kids on the YMCA team. They were all great kids but like others have said social skills were lacking. I think it was more of an issue that the parents were waiting too long to get them active. A lot of times they waited until the kid was 12 or 13 before putting them into social settings.

If you plan on homeschooling be sure to get them involved consistently from a young age to keep the social skills up.

Also, I’m going public schools with our son (just like I did) when he’s school age in a couple years. We considered the “semi-private” charter schools which are kind private run public schools but our public system is one of the best in the state so we’re just going that route.

Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:02

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You’re in Bham right? What school are you considering if you don’t mind me asking.

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:04

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Why not send the kiddo to public school, but concentrate on helping them learn (or teaching other lessons) when they’re home? Best of both worlds.

Unless your local public schools are terrible/violent/drug filled, there's no reason to avoid them.

Urambo Tauro > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:05

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Homeschooling is great for education, but not so much for social skills. That can be partially helped by finding some kind of social outlet, like participation in church activities.

BBlades > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:05

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I went through home schooling, public, and private schooling during my education. They all have their pros and cons. For example, too much public school might get your kid lost in the educational shuffle. Too much private school might make your kid a little snot. Too much home schooling might make your kid socially awkward.

There is no one size fits all, these decisions are really important, as they shape your child’s maturation and skills.

Ash78, voting early and often > BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind 04/25/2016 at 10:07

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That's sort of my vote, but we both realize that all the elementary schools feed into a "marginal" middle school and a ridiculously large, overcrowded high school. I think my wife's big thing is that she wants the kids to go all the way through school without jumping around. The private school we're considering is K-12. Homeschooling is obviously a whole different animal. Our real aversion to public school isn't so much that they won't get the instruction they need, it's the inefficiency of the long schoolday and the negative social influences that tend to hit a little too early...lowest common denominators on bad language, habits, etc.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:08

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While I can’t offer any experience from public school or homeschooling, I can say that I believe my private school education was well worth it. It’s not that you can’t get a great education in a public school, particularly at some of the very good ones, but that private schools seem to require more of their students. This is in comparison to what I heard from my friends who went to public schools, granted those were AZ public schools which are statistically poor. Some of my basic courses sounded like they were on par with AP/Honors courses at public schools.

I noticed when I got to college that I was far better prepared for the curriculum, in fact much of it was easier than high school. In particular, I noticed that my writing and grammar skills were far beyond many of my peers in college.

For a bit of reference, I went to a K-8 private Catholic school and then a private Jesuit college prep school (regarded as one of the best schools in Arizona) for 9-12.

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:15

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I went to public school from K-8 and private school for high school. I was in a similar situation where the elementary school was good, the middle school marginal, and the high school not very good. I don’t know that your kids need to be in private their entire school career, maybe go public from K-6 then jump to private once they reach middle school, only one jump isn’t bad.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:19

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You have any charter schools in the area?

phobos512 > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:20

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You can’t keep your kids in a protective bubble their whole lives. There’s nothing wrong with exposing them to the real world - just teach them boundaries. Schooling isn't just about education. It's about learning to function as an independent entity around other independent entities who aren't always in it for one's own best interests. They can't learn how to cope with the world if they're kept from it.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow 04/25/2016 at 10:27

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Another big point, and what I think is actually one of the strongest sellers for private school, is the social aspect. You’re generally surrounding your children with children from more successful/educated/wealthy families. I’m not saying that they’re better people, but that they’re more likely to have the resources to be successful.

Pretty much everything in life comes down to who you know and the people you surround yourself with. The friends I made at my private school, verses my public school friends, have largely been much more successful in life. They went to better colleges, or just simply went to college, and many have been very successful in their professional lives (I’m 27 for reference). Public school friends of mine have done the same, but it’s been less of them and none have been as successful as the most successful private school friends. And private school friends of mine have been just as big of burnouts as some public school friends, but in much lower numbers.

Hollywood’s general portrayal of the good kid stuck in a snobby private school where all the kids are entitled little pricks, while his public school friend, from the salt of the earth less-fortunate family down the road, is a much better person/friend, is a pretty inaccurate one from my experience. You’re surrounding your kids with other children who are statistically more likely to go further in life, and the idea that they’re all little narcissists with pill popping moms and cheating dads is quite inaccurate. (I’m sure this isn’t your view of the matter, but just something I wanted to state. haha)

Ash78, voting early and often > If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent 04/25/2016 at 10:27

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Nope, we’re one of the ~20 states that don’t allow them except for rare/special exceptions. None in my city.

Ash78, voting early and often > phobos512 04/25/2016 at 10:28

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They already have plenty of that, I'm not worried about socialization in the least. Both kids are very outgoing and have tons of friends. This isn't about a bubble — this is about being motivated to excel, not sink into mediocrity like my wife and I believe we both did (and most of our peers).

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind 04/25/2016 at 10:35

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This sounds like a good idea, until you hear that modern pedagogy very often says that the kid shouldn’t be getting help at home, at least in some topics. No, really. Common Core math and its focus on teaching kids shortcut/trick based math and very... odd emphasis on set theory and other topics (which IMO are a math equivalent of the “whole word” farce in reading from a while back) have some very odd ideas attached. It has been stated that a kid learning the “old” basics at home and getting reinforcement is a risk to the kid of learning these Groundbreaking New Methods wrong , and that parents risk being too stupid to figure out the Groundbreaking New Methods to help their kid, so they shouldn’t try.

Also, parents being limited in their ability to help their kid has led to the smear on tiger parents that “maybe their kid isn’t as smart as they thought”. Y’know, because leveling the playing field through fucking up the learning process and limiting help available for some is the same thing as exposing a kid as being the dumb.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:39

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I went to one for 7th grade onwards. Smaller class size (10-15 kids per class) meant better one-on-one learning with the teachers and the emphasis they placed on community from the beginning got rid of most if not all of the negative things that occur when you put a bunch of teens in a building together.

Tripper > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:43

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I don’t have kids yet and it’s been a little while since I was one, but when I was in highschool/college the kids that came from home schooling environments had a tough time adjusting. Not that being a weirdo is the net-net of homeschooling, but there is something to be said for going to school, getting bullied/doing some bullying, playing sports/other extracurriculars, getting your heart broken etc...

My future kids will be going to public school, unless I can easily afford to send them to private school. It is my opinion that average students often go by the wayside in most public high schools. If your kid is super smart or super dumb they seem to get all kinds of attention. If you coast by with B’s like I did in high school, nobody cares and then you get to college and realize that “coasting” in college is much more difficult.

OPPOsaurus WRX > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:49

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this is based on no facts so dont take it too seriously, but I wouldn’t homeschool because I would imagine they need the social experience. If you keep a kid home for school they wont be able to interact on the same level..... then again, with the way kids are these days, they may never leave the basement

Ash78, voting early and often > OPPOsaurus WRX 04/25/2016 at 10:52

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The funny thing is that was my impression, too, until a couple years ago. Virtually every homeschool group I've seen out on field trips, or bumped into at the park, YMCA pool (or wherever) have had some of the best-behaved, kindest, and most well adjusted and mature kids for their age. That's what impressed us most of all — seeing proof that our old stereotypes were wrong. Of course, I'm sure there's some chicken * egg about parents who do it solely to shield their kids, not to help them excel.

Rock Bottom > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 10:54

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For what it’s worth, my parents sacrificed mightily so that my sister and I could attend private schools from K to 12 and I definitely felt that I had a leg-up on most other kids my age when I went to college. The most obvious advantage seemed to be with spoken grammar (my written grammar remains a bit sloppy). That being said, the advantages didn’t prevent me from being ejected from the university after my second semester, necessitating an expensive and time consuming “long-way-round” approach to an engineering degree!

I did work with a brother and sister years ago who were both home schooled. They were impressively knowledgeable in most subjects and had impeccable manners and spoken grammar. I know their parents had utilized a home schooling system that was developed by a Christian “academy” here in Michigan, but I have no idea how that whole process worked. I suspect they purchased course plans and recommended texts from the academy, but I can’t prove that. Regardless, it worked well for them and now they’re both in their 30s and are fantastic people. The kind of people you’d ask to watch your kids without thinking twice.

Andy Sheehan, StreetsideStig > OPPOsaurus WRX 04/25/2016 at 10:57

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These days most legitimate homeschool families are part of homeschooling networks, which meet with other families throughout the week for certain classes like PE. Or so I’ve heard.

OPPOsaurus WRX > Andy Sheehan, StreetsideStig 04/25/2016 at 11:00

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yea I know nothing about that, it sounds better than I had expected

E92M3 > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 11:00

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My son attends a private school, and I can tell you he’s picked up bad habits already. You see, most of the parents are very successful, which means they are extremely busy. Too busy to spend time parenting their kids, and teaching them right from wrong. They work 60+hours a week. The handful of hours spent with their kids, they are spoiling them. There’s a few exceptions where the mother doesn’t work, and isn’t too busy playing tennis/doing yoga. Many of the families are made up of 2- workaholic parents though.

The reality is it’s like a fraternity. It’s not what you know, it’s who you know. Many of these kids are born into success. The parents own successful businesses, or are CEO’s of major corporations. They automatically have great opportunities waiting for them when they graduate college. Not bad lifelong friends to have, even though they can be brats right now.

Flyboy is FAA certified insane > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 11:22

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It depends on where you live. Where I went to school I could’ve never imagined why anyone would homeschool their children and deprive them of the socialization.

But here in Florida, you’d be hard pressed to make me send my children to these “schools"

shop-teacher > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 11:53

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Obviously I’m biased, but I am a big believer in public education. There is no way to get the full range of classes and experiences that a GOOD public school can offer in a private or home schooling environment. Of course if the schools aren’t good, all bets are off.

I’ve seen home schooling go very well and very poorly. If you keep the kids in a routine, actually make them do the work and get the learning, and keep them involved socially in other stuff (neighborhood kids, sports, scouts, whatever), then it can be fine. There was a family who lived two doors down from me growing up, they home schooled their four boys through 8th grade, and then they went to public high school. Their kids were awesome, and very successful. The youngest was four years older than me and my friends, but he and the next older one still played with us and taught us a lot of stuff, they were kind of our big brothers.

I’ve also seen home schooled kids where the parents gave up and sent them to public school in middle school. Some of them were desperately behind and terribly awkward.

Like anything I guess, it is what you make of it.

G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3 > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 12:00

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I’m homeschooled, and I can tell you this. My grade average before I entered homeschooling was about 73%. My current grade average is 89%. Bit of a difference there, eh?

TheRealBicycleBuck > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 12:31

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It’s a lot of hard work to homeschool kids and most parents aren’t up to the task. Think of it this way - each of the teachers at the public or private school has many more hours of education in their subject than most of the parents out there and the educational requirements have increased to the point where the kids today are learning in middle school what we learned in high school. Consider whether you and your wife have the same level of education in history, science, math, social studies, english, and reading/writing, as any of the teachers who specialize in these subjects and the training to properly educate students of all ages, not just a few grades.

Homeschooling parents are a lot like engineers - they think they know enough about everything to be able to do it on their own. They also tend to be a bit socially awkward. I think this is why so many people are commenting about the sociability of homeschooled children.

I have met a number of homeschooled kids. I have yet to meet one that was not a bit strange, even kids that had parents that were highly educated. I’m not sure if it is because the parents were a little odd themselves or if it was the lack of socialization.

Private schools insulate the kids from a lot of the real-world hoopla that plagues public schools. My wife works for the public school system - one of the reasons our kids go to private school. She regales me with the stories that aren’t big enough to make the local news, but are more than enough to make us want to keep our kids out of the fray. Sex in the bathrooms, bullying, beatings, drugs - it’s all par for the course in the public middle schools in our area. As they like to say here in Louisiana, “Thank God for Mississippi. If not for them, our schools would be last.”

Ash78, voting early and often > TheRealBicycleBuck 04/25/2016 at 12:38

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That gets a high-five from me in Alabama :D To be fair to our suburban small town in a historic district, we have a great elementary school, but it’s the overall system we don’t really like. Plagued with politics, always behind the curve on adapting to new/immigrant populations, yet still considered one of the best in the state, at least on paper (but what does that really say when most of our state's schools are among the worst in the nation?). My wife was a part time sub in this system for 2+ years and has seen a lot what you're describing firsthand.

jariten1781 > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 13:03

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Lots of anecdotal experience. Wife and I have very financially diverse families (ie from literal backwoods dwellers on my mother’s side to full on trust funds and independent wealth on her mother’s side to everything in between). I can track the educational backgrounds through about 3 generations.

Home School: Total crap shoot. Well meaning, smart parents ended up with mal-adjusted undereducated in some subjects kids. However, this also produced a god damned genius pianist and a very smart financial advisor. Knowing them both though, I think that was more inherent on them as people than their education. There’s always the socialization issue as well. Every single homeschool parent thinks they have it figured out through clubs or sports or boy scouts or whatever...they don’t. It’s a very hard problem. Socializing for 5-10 hours a week just plain isn’t the same as socializing for 8 hours every single day plus an additional 5-10 hours a week. It just isn’t and cannot be. Even the home-school co-ops don’t work out the same. You’re in the same class with the same 10-20 people your entire education...that’s just different compared to being in a pool of 500-3000 peers. I’ve got a couple nieces going down that path right now, and, while they’re really sweet girls, it’s extremely obvious within minutes that they are different . Kids pick up on that, adults pick up on that, and it will be a disadvantage to them once they’re off fending for themselves.

Private School: Every single private schooled kid in the family was supremely advantaged in K-6. This is fact across many states both with new-agy schools to ‘institutes’ to stodgy old Catholic schools. It’s not even close...the dim bulbs in private elementary schools had knowledge that rivaled the smartest kids in public and homeschools when looking at broad basics. The smart non-private kids would have vastly better knowledge than the dim private-school kids in the subjects they had a personal interest in, but their knowledge of their non-favorite subjects was absolutely below those of the private school kids. That advantage somewhat disappeared in 7&8 and was almost completely gone when it came to more targeted secondary education. The advanced courses later in public schools seemed very much on-par with the similar courses in private high school. I can’t compare the non-advanced courses at both because all the family members I know who worked a non-advanced curriculum were minimal workers who weren’t particularly attempting to avail themselves of their education. I have seen troubled kids corrected by being pulled out of public schools and put in more focused private schools for high school though.

Public Schools: Baseline knowledge sucks. General courses suck. Specialized courses/Gifted classes prior to high school suck. It’s all imminently able to be overcome by involved parenting, but it’s a big disadvantage compared to private schools. However, there are more broad available opportunities, especially at the High School level. Public schools are better at sports, drama, music, debate, etc. as well odd courses like psychology/sociology that private schools just shoehorn in. Plus, many public schools still have stuff like home ec., shop, auto repair, etc. Now, there are targeted private schools for those things (drama, music, art, etc.) but they fail completely at creating a well rounded student.

So in total my experience says homeschooled kids are disadvantaged compared to either public or private schooled kids across the board. The ones that overcame that disadvantage did it through their own sheer force of personality and will...it can't be parented out of. Private school kids were advantaged across the board in elementary. That advantage is not massive and can be overcome by involved parenting of public school children. Once the transition to high school occurs it's pretty much a wash. Public schools offer more broad opportunities at that point and private schools have the option for intense focus. There it really comes down to the types of programs (and quality of schools) available and the desires of the family.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 13:39

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Our area has seen huge growth, mostly due to the public schools being among the best in the state. That puts them into the top schools in the second-worst state in the nation. :/

Being in the private system makes a huge difference. According to standardized testing, my daughter is among the top 5% in the nation. She is one of 10 in her class that landed in that group. Top 5% in the nation, but only top 17% in her class at school. :) Yeah, I’m proud.

Since you are trying to make a decision on which route to go, it’s a good idea to visit each of the schools and talk to the administration about their academic performance. Keep in mind that many of the private schools have competitive entry requirements. Also note that many of the private schools offer scholarships to those in need.

Although expensive, private school in our area is about the cost of single trip to Disneyland. Some parents take their kids every year. Some parents spend the money on private school instead.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow 04/25/2016 at 13:44

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There’s a big difference between the Catholic school system and non-religious private schools.

Chris_K_F drives an FR-Slow > TheRealBicycleBuck 04/25/2016 at 14:20

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Yeah, I suppose that’s a good point. The funny thing was, my Jesuit school was full of kids from all religious backgrounds too; Jewish, Muslim, Mormon, Sikh, Catholic, Lutheran, etc.

I really valued the social justice part of going to a Jesuit school. We had yearly immersion trips to Mexico, they had several to New Orleans when Katrina happened, and lots of other local involvement. We were also required to do a senior service project with 120 hours of community service at charities around the area. It was a pretty cool experience. Plus we had the resources for a lot more activities, teams, clubs, and opportunities. I really wish that I had realized better how awesome it was when I was there, and gotten more involved in extracurricular stuff.

It was enough to make me really want to go to Loyola for my MBA. But that ~$70,000-$80,000+ price tag is a bit of a deterrent. lol

jminer > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 14:26

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I’ve known quite a few homesschooled kids, and my Wife worked with many groups advising them and administering the required tests for homeschoolers.

The main question is what you want for your children. In most states homeschoolers will ‘graduate high school‘ with a GED (after they take the GED test). That won’t allow them to get into most colleges. If you see your child going to community college and then a trade, it should be fine. They’ll only be able to get into a state school if their scores are incredible, they’ll likely never get into a good private college unless they are a genius (140+ IQ).

On the public vs private debate. I graduated from public and had no problems with it. I went to an OK school where I was able to take AP classes and learn a few things. If you live in a nice suburban area than you are probably better off sending them to public, they are well funded, have excellent class offerings, and user cirriculum approved by your state board of education.

I would only go Private school if your local public schools are terrible, or you want your child to have a more religious upbringing.

Fun Fact: most segregated (male vs female) private schools have drastically higher STD and Pregnancy rates when compared to the public schools in the area. That’s what the lack of a sex ed program will do...

TheRealBicycleBuck > jariten1781 04/25/2016 at 15:23

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“Public schools are better at sports, drama, music, debate, etc. as well odd courses like psychology/sociology that private schools just shoehorn in. Plus, many public schools still have stuff like home ec., shop, auto repair, etc. Now, there are targeted private schools for those things (drama, music, art, etc.) but they fail completely at creating a well rounded student.”

Private schools are a big deal here in Louisiana and the breadth of the programs at the high school level is breathtaking. We have been visiting the major schools in preparation for our soon-to-be high school age kids. There is no shortage of advanced classes, resources, and clubs to keep the kids interested. Home economics is still alive, but none of them have courses in auto repair. I’ve seen stages for drama, amazing science labs, even more amazing technology labs (one had 10 3D printers for the kids to use), and all of them have advanced robotics courses. Perhaps it is because we have such a strong private school system here.

Ash78, voting early and often > TheRealBicycleBuck 04/25/2016 at 15:50

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And I think we're trying to do both :D We've got our meetings set up for both this week so we can make a better decision. Our son (leaving Kindergarten) is already well ahead of most of his peers academically, we just don't want to see his enthusiasm and encouragement dwindle as he moves from a class of 12 to a class of 20+. That takes some dedicated teachers.

Ash78, voting early and often > jariten1781 04/25/2016 at 15:52

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Thanks for this thorough reply! Very helpful...

TheRealBicycleBuck > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 16:18

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No kidding there! Teachers are the most important part of the equation. Small private schools, unless they are really, really expensive, tend to have trouble attracting and keeping the best teachers. We’ve run into a few that I’d like to strangle (yeah, I’m looking at you Ms. Math Teacher).

ttyymmnn > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 17:36

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I don’t have any experience with home schooling, but I do know I’d never want to try to school my kids. They don’t listen to me as it is. I can say, though, that you get out of public education what you put into it. Unlike when I was a kid, parents have to be completely involved in what is going on in the school and the classroom. For me, being a member of PTA is a minimum requirement (I’m on the board of my elementary PTA). Networking with other parents is a great way to keep track of what’s going on in the school, and which teachers to avoid. When it comes time for class assignments for the next grade, parents do have a certain amount of say in the assignment (at least at my school), and being visible and active at the school can only work in your favor.

I have played trumpet at commencement ceremonies for two of the elite private middle and upper schools here in town. They are top flight schools, with top flight tuition to boot, but there is a distinct lack of diversity that I find disturbing. I have always felt that public education is as much a life education as it is a book education. And some of the fears you mentioned will happen in any school, private or public. It’s incumbent upon parents to monitor their kids and what they’re bringing home. Hell, my kids are learning more bad stuff from YouTube than they are from kids at school, though we’ve already had our first experience with a kid asking my son to hold a gun for him, albeit a BB gun. Thankfully, he was smart enough to say no.

For all its problems, I remain dedicated to the public school model, unless I end up at a school that is just completely unsuccessful. Parental involvement is key, and that varies widely from school to school. Good luck!

Ash78, voting early and often > ttyymmnn 04/25/2016 at 17:38

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Great perspective, thanks. Now that you mention YouTube, I already dread that...it’s right around the corner. For now, my son (5) is still a Google Map fanatic and says he wants to be a mapmaker when he grows up. These are the Golden Years...

ttyymmnn > Ash78, voting early and often 04/25/2016 at 17:46

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My first career goal was to be a cartographer. This was in the days before computers. I was fascinated by the hand-drawn maps of the 1940s, particularly maps of WWII. My father is also an inveterate traveler, and we always had Rand McNally atlases sitting around the house. I would look at them for hours. I had a city map of Chicago hanging on my bedroom wall. Alas, my grades in HS were poor, and no colleges would accept me as a geography major. I ended up being a musician, since it was the only thing I could do. There are many times when I wish I could have had taken my first choice. *sigh* I use that story in hopes of encouraging my son to do well in school, so he can follow his first career choice.

Ash78, voting early and often > ttyymmnn 04/26/2016 at 07:51

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Since we’re on the topic, I was a super nerdy kid in school who (at least until the high school lazy/Gen X/grunge phase) wanted to do nothing more than fly an F-16 or an A-10 for a living. Hell, I still do. But I didn’t get a lot of “forced motivation” from my parents — they were the polar opposite of today’s helicopter parents. For fun, I would have my parents read an atlas and name a small or medium city somewhere, and I’d have to name the state. I still absolutely love geography and spatial relations, but I had no idea it could segue into a career at all...so I ended up starting school in engineering, finishing in business, and working a mindless reporting/database job in banking. But it pays the bill and I have a wonderful family — I just would much rather see the kids pursue something they love first, have an entrepreneurial spirit about it, and be fulfilled in their school and work.

CloudHackIX > jariten1781 09/14/2016 at 11:49

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This is an excellent observation of all three approaches!

My parents did a fine job of home-schooling me and my sister through elementary and middle-school levels, after which we re-joined the public school system for high-school and college. What you point out about the student’s own personality and will-power is very spot-on.

While I have taken nearly 10 years to complete college, I have been employed as an engineer through most of it. Unlike me, my sister graduated on-time and is also doing well.

Over this entire period, I feel the most important things my parents couldn’t provide was the societal knowledge I gained from high-school, and the combination of deep technical knowledge and professional networking I found at college. Prior to HS I had some anxiety issues, which I worked through and conquered on my own. In college, I owe my current employment and career success to the clubs and people I met.